Eve, Thank you for presenting much food for the thinking folk....you have said a great deal...we must always remember that there is more than one side to any presentation..there are at least three, the right, the wrong and the presentation's....Every one has an agenda, and you need to know what it is before blindly following.

Mama - As you probably noticed - I question not only the Enviroes' Agenda, but also Big Business' Agenda. We all want clean water, clean air & a healthy place for future generations to live. We have made mistakes, hopefully we learn from them, and don't allow the developing nations to make the More...

Yes, Eve, it can be an interesting dance. At what point does Weyerhauser's or Exxon's participation in a 'wise use' group begin to undermine its credibility? Thta's when you have to take into consideration the one thing more important to politicians than money...votes. I have worked with some of More...

IAN: Yes (re-)election is the primary goal of a politician (obtain/maintain power). Organizational (corporations, unions, special interest groups, etc.) money is required to fuel their election and media backing. Politicians remember the idioms: 'Don't bite the Hand that Feeds You' & 'Go-along More...

In Australia our Head of State is a person nominated by the gov and ratified by the Queen. When we sever our ties with England we want a Head of State to be (as has been in the past) a good and worthy person, a 'statesman'. We do NOT want the system whereby money appears to be the sole criterion for election. What is the alternative?

Was it something I said?

No Mary - I guess no one is interested in discussing issues. The question is where do we find a good and worthy person, a 'statesman'.

I think many people don't look beyond the outside trappings - are they good looking, their hair, dress, etc. Not who they are, what their values are, if More...

Oh Eve, You have said what I've felt but didn't quite know how to put in words....we need those we see as 'leaders' to see that 'we the people' need to feel we will be represented! Its okay that the wealthy have a say, yet it shouldn't be the only say that makes a difference. The old time More...

A friend who has been working for several years now sending out packages to the troops recently received this email from 1LT Jay Schulz Mahmudiyah, Iraq. I believe it is worth sharing. It may take several posts to complete, so bear with me.

Hello all,

Although I already received More...

Just as every Iraqi child will grow up to have an opinion about American troops (good or bad), every member of the military who serves in a war zone will have an opinion about the support they feel American citizens are giving them. I may not be able to explain why it is so vitally important that More...

Hey Eve, thanx for your letter. It brings to life the day to day realities of living there that we at home cannot realize. We,also, have a much smaller role there and, sad to say, reportage is mostly limited to gross acts of barbarism.

Eve...Thank you....those two well meant words are not used and directed towards ALL who make the effort that Lt. Schultz was speaking about, often enough. I thank you for sharing the letter. It brings them much closer to those of us here in the safety of our homes. Those men and women deserve the More...

I debated which forum I should put this topic in. When I realized the voices in my head were arguing where it should go, it occurred to me that the debate forum was the place to be. Since it could be a debatable topic.

Chemicals vs. Home Remedies Cleaners

I personally choose the More...

If I missed something or something needs to be clarified just let me know.

Karen, Home remedies work well and I have used them in many of the same ways you have. They are also cheaper,so why not save money as well. Vinegar can also be a health aid, it helps to heal bruises from falls, or bumping into things, etc.....simply soak cotton balls in vinegar and apply it to the More...

In line with some of the recent conversations, and armed with why manufacturers have started the practice of 'protective wrappings' on their products, I have wondered if others find the 'over wrapping' to be not only wasteful and costly, but also annoyingly difficult to get into. I have discontinued buying some products simply due to their hard to open packaging. Any thoughts?

Mamacita 2 here in England about a month ago there was an article on the news which showed a man in his local supermarket midway through a protest. What he does is as he is paying for his items he takes off all the excess packaging and rewraps the items in his own paper and leaves all the plastic More...

karen I much prefer simpler methods of cleaning if and when I clean. Most of the newer brands of cleaning products just don't cut the mustard.

André, I'm with you, especially the if and when

Andrè, That is a man after my own heart! I can only hope that someone will start listening....soon!

Mamacita 2--never thought about using vinegar for bruises--guess cause I am not a bruiser type of person.
Though I have been known to put vinegar in my bath to ease sore muscles.

Anre does that mean you use the old ways of cleaning or the chemicals they call cleaners today?

One of my classes is being used--just had a brain squirt.
Mamacita 2 you touched on this in your comment.

Anyway, we learned that what is absorbed by the ground goes into our drinking water. I have semi-stopped using tap water. I held up a glass of water one day and saw a bunch of little More...

The whole business of excess packaging was not a marketing decision; it is one that grew out of the society we are in. That bulk packaging is there for one reason...to make things more difficult to steal, by virtue of their bulk.

Karen I use both methods, lots of lemon to clean the old oven, vinegar for the windows etc works a treat even though I get covered in newsprint which is not the most pleasant of things.
Ian I hadn't thought about that as a reason for packaging I just presumed that it was for the 'ultimate' way of stopping you getting to the food when you are hungry...

And who will make the post of the Great Beast, 666?

Why be afraid...he was banished before, have no fear when you walk with The One ....If you believe, as I do...its no problem...If you are not a beliver..it should not present a problem because its all meaningless....take your choices..make your move....May peace be with you!

Karen: http://www.abc.net.au/brisbane/stories/s1550017.htm

is a helpful link - this lady has taken things back to the basics, so much so that supermarkets are having a hard time stocking the shelves quickly enough with Bicarb and vinegar...

Thank you Billy--I went to Shannon Lush's site. I try to stay away from chemicals as much as possible. I regret not keeping up with my herbs that had so really good affects on cleaning, to health issues. They smelt and looked good too.

Maybe a project for Girlie-girl and me next summer. Is there a garden forum--I need a garden forum.

Start one Karen. That's a great idea. There's lots of gardeners here in Sudokuland.

A contentious issue perhaps... A secondary chat room put in place to sit beside the original. The new chat room could be a 'no holds barred' version, so anyone going in there would understand the implications of going in and thus no complaints if another goes in who is not to their liking, causes More...

They could be named Heaven or Hell - you choose!!

Andrè, I see nothing contentious in your suggestion of two chat rooms offering a choice for those who wish to be free from some of the current restrictions of the one chat room. One would not have to use either, as you say. Personally, I feel we have ample exchange oportuntities, with eveything More...

I would enjoy it, André. It was a lot of fun, and anyone who was afraid of it would still have a refuge in the ''tamer'' one. This would be very different from the last time, since there was only one chatroom and a single [supply your own adjective here] individual could make things uncomfortable More...

André - have you asked Gath? I think there would be many that would support your suggestion. I have asked gath if we could revert back to the 'old format' on a trial basis and he said 'No Way!!' ( from his response I gathered that the problems were huge - far more than we realised) - but this may More...

André
that is a great idea also, I didnt have an issue with the other chatroom either but I know Gath had big problems, much more than we all know about.
I do not understand however how it can be too difficult to make up a hotmail, yahoo or some other basic email address and then use any name More...

Re: A new Chatroom

Andre
Having been one that was subjected to some problems/trouble in the chat room, I have welcomed the security of having registered members use the chat room.

I don’t necessarily agree with the idea for a new chat room. I do miss all the fun and banter that More...

ooops lost the 2nd half of my post..
A new Chatroom. part 2
Andre
The excuse given by many for not registering as you have stated “thus ensuring their personal details are not used for any marketing ploy or such like” to me is one that l laugh at.

I would find it very hard to More...

Ok, my final word on this today LOL
Andre why not open up a new forum page titled 'Need for a new chatroom'. Doing this would enable others who visit the site to see the discussion and voice their opioning instead of wading through 17 pages of info in here. Also it would give Gath a bigger picture on everyones opinion and make his decision easier.

Wise words Angie.

I'll add my two cents worth. I have only participated in the site chat room once (and this might be only my first time in this discussion page), so I can by no means be considered knowledgeable of this subject. I have chosen not to participate. This site offers a chance for friends to be friends, More...